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Facing Mortality

Posted by Viktoria Michaelis on February 26, 2014 in News & Opinion |

Jane Fonda is, apparently, scared of dying. I suspect that many people share much the same feeling, that they must, sooner or late, leave this small planet and take the inevitable step beyond life into an unknown or non-existent future. Death is something we all have in common, no matter who we are, where we come from, how rich or poor, good or bad we are or have been.

Many may well be of the opinion that Jane Fonda, at seventy-six, should have come to terms with what must happen one day many years ago. It’s not as if she is unintelligent, and certainly not that she can’t have known that death will visit her one day. And yet, according to an article in the Daily Mail, she hasn’t found the time to sit down and consider this future. It is also fair to say that she has had a life many other people envy, no matter how she may see it. But, at seventy-six, to complain that you have so little time left?

Perhaps she should be grateful for the many years she has already had, and enjoy these last years, no matter how many she may still have. It’s not as if she doesn’t have the means and resources.

  • Viktoria Michaelis.

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20 Comments

  • primoveritas says:

    Ms. Fonda, at age seventy-six, has never seriously taken the time to research, and/or prove, whether or not there really is an entity who promises a future resurrection and a wondrous afterlife, for those who have consistently obeyed/implemented the principles found within His instruction book.

    Hence, she is fearful of dying because she is afraid of the unknown.

    • I tend to disagree with you on this point. It’s not about reading any books, it’s about the inner feelings. She cannot imagine leaving this world that she knows so well, cannot imagine anything outside of what her mind and body already know to exist. It makes no difference whether there is some form of afterlife or not, only whether a person can come to terms with not Being.

  • primoveritas says:

    Relying SOLELY upon ones “inner feelings,” especially NEGATIVE feelings, can be a surefire recipe for impending disaster. The majority of ones ideologies (mind-set) is composed over the years, from information accumulated from parents, family members, friends, teachers, preachers, books, newspapers, art, television, the Internet, films, music, etc., which the human mind has been taught and/or is steadily exposed to. Thus, one has to be personally responsible for researching and proving for themselves, whether the information given to them, is really accurate, and then to analyze whether the end results that are viewed over a reasonable measure of time, are positive or negative in nature.

    There’s a classic line from an old Western wherein a cowboy rides out into the desert, takes off all of his clothes and promptly jumps into a stand of thorny cacti. Another cowpoke soon comes along and asks: “Whatever made you do a stupid thing like that?” The scratched and profusely bleeding cowboy replies: “It seemed like a good idea at the time.” See? You CAN’T only rely on “inner feelings” :-)

    Peace,

    Primoveritas

    • First impressions, those Inner Feelings, are often far more important as a means of protection, of assessing another person or a situation than people give credit for. What we know of the world is based on experience as much as what we learn from other people, and especially on proof. If you don’t try something for yourself, within certain limits, you’re not going to gain the necessary life experience we all need. This does not apply to any Afterlife, since a further existence after death cannot be proven one way or the other. No matter what anyone claims, be they a preacher, a teacher or the man on the street, there is no one with the necessary experience to say that there is or there is not an Afterlife.

      Your example with the cowboy makes no sense in this connection. This is not a case of Inner Feelings, this is a case of misjudgement: it seemed like a good idea at the time. It is something we all go through many times in our lives: we experiment, we make mistakes, we have successes.

      The Afterlife cannot be tested through experiment nor through experience since, either way, you’re not going to be coming back from the Afterlife to make use of the experience you’ve gained. And it is my experience that those who are deeply religious, those who ‘obey/implement’ the instruction manual(!) are more prone to fears than those who don’t, since they can never be sure whether they’ve done everything ‘right’ during their lives. Religion is a fear-creator, an oppressor, and not an answer.

      My example of Jane Fonda is more a comment on her personal fears. She may well be a religious person, may well have read many religious texts in all different directions. This is something we cannot judge since we do not have the information. Her Inner Feelings are those of a person who fears death, and that can strike a deeply religious person as much as anyone else: a step, unavoidable, into the unknown is always going to raise certain fears, some greater than others. It is these fears she is trying to come to terms with and, it appears, unsuccessfully. She can see her fate – Death – the same as we all see our fate on the horizon, and no matter which books we may read, no matter what we may believe in, these fears remain.

  • Primoveritas says:

    Each human comes equipped with a brain, instinct, conscience and the freedom to make choices, whether positive or negative. If the end results of something, experienced by others, is consistently negative, why would anyone want “to try something” for themselves in order “to gain the necessary life experience we all need?” If someone insists upon putting a high caliber pistol to their head and pull the trigger, there is an overwhelming belief that the individual will either die or that the effects of his or her choice will result in massive, probably irreparable brain damage. I realize I’ve presented an extreme example which is NOT your typical “within certain limits” assertion, however, there are those who insist upon engaging in certain things, which, over a period of time, end up producing NEGATIVE results. For example, innocently consuming the wrong kinds of food can slowly lead to premature aging and death. How would one’s “Inner Feelings” provide advance, factual information for not eating such harmful foods if there was no source one could turn to in order to be enlightened? Personal trial and error is not a very wise alternative when compared to being warned in advance, by others who have already traversed that erroneous path. Yet, many drug users don’t seem to get the message.

    Regarding whether “there is or there is not an Afterlife,” we have been introduced to the ancient writings of Aristotle, Plato and Socrates, and most individuals do not seem to admonish the integrity of these men or refute the existence of their compositions. Yet, whenever one who rose from the dead, and was seen thereafter by family members, personal friends, etc. for nearly six weeks (over five hundred people saw him in one day!), and the FACTS surrounding such an event were articulately penned for posterity, detractors immediately decry and attempt to refute the integrity of the eye-witnesses and recorded historical facts. Why? Simply because the “instruction book,” which remains a worldwide best seller, and yet is gathering dust in the majority of homes, has been erroneously declared and referred to as being…”medieval, out of date, just a collection of Jewish folktales, mysticism, contradictory, fallible, containing graphic incidents of incest, rape, murder, etc.,” ad nauseam, ad infinitum!

    My cowboy example does make “sense.” He did not consider his negative plight as being “a case of misjudgment” until AFTER he realized that his “Inner Feelings” had led him astray.

    It is possible that Jane Fonda is more afraid of what will transpire, AFTER she takes her last breath, as opposed to dying. Also, I think it is safe to opine, that human beings do not relish painful suffering as a prerequisite towards a slow and agonizing demise. I’ve piloted small planes, dived in shark infested waters in Australia off the Great Barrier Reef, para-sailed in Mazatlan, rode horseback in bandit infested hills/mountains of Puerto Vallarta, raced motorcycles and high-powered automobiles, sky-dived, etc. Through it all, I’ve maintained a healthy, profound respect for life, but there is always that gnawing consciousness of impending death. Nevertheless, the ONE thing I feared the most, was the thought of paralysis if something went terribly wrong. So far as death itself, the one who came back to life, simply referred to death as being “asleep,” totally being unaware of anything, while awaiting a future resurrection.

    Peace,

    Primoveritas

    • The only reason these holy writings, the Bible and so on, are accepted as truth is because these holy writings tell us that they are true. There is little to no evidence that events actually happened as written from other sources. Accepting a book which was composed many hundreds of years after the events merely because the book tells us it is true is more inner feelings than relying on facts. And this book should be seen more as an historical narrative than an instruction book, unless you wish to tell me that everything in the book is correct and we should follow all the instructions. Which, of course, would mean that women are of lesser worth than men; may be raped or loaned out for sex; that more than one wife is acceptable; that we cannot wear certain garments because they are of mixed fabrics and so on. If you wish to claim that it is an instruction manual for life, then you cannot simply pick and choose, you must accept the whole or none of it. You should also remember that much of what is in this book, much of what the Christian religion offers, is taken over from older religions and beliefs, it is not unique, it is an assimilation of beliefs which were considered heathen, that the only way to conquer these heathen beliefs was to integrate them into a new religion. Even the resurrection is hardly a new concept, and may be found in Egyptian and other mythologies: if it is not original and other beliefs followed both the idea of an afterlife and a second coming, it is fair to assume that we will see many resurrections at some stage. Jesus was not the first, he was merely given – by later religious generations – this extra little bit of a sparkle of a return.

      When you quote philosophers from the pre-Christian era you should remember that their belief was based on completely different gods, and shouldn’t be so selective as to forget such writers and thinkers as Epicurus and Lucretius whose works tell us that they did not believe in a god or afterlife, merely in this life on earth. When you quote the story of a cowboy, you shouldn’t forget free will. He may well have chosen to throw himself into a bunch of cacti, but not through inner feelings, merely because, as you said, it seemed to be a good idea at the time.

    • Francois Demers says:

      I’ve read big, heavy books, dived in the librarian-infested halls in Massachusetts off the Great Abomination of Cape Cod, taken photographs at Chicken Itza (spelling mine), faced Woody Woodpecker at Port Aventura, raced my daddy’s Chevrolet falling-down drunk against an Alfa Romeo (and won), married a (shudders) woman and I had a baby (winking at Viktoria) star-gazed, etc. Through it all, I’ve maintained an unhealthy, shallow attitude to life, but there is always that encroaching maturity that preludes senescence. Nevertheless, the ONE thing I feared the most, was the thought that sports and adrenaline entertainment would one day become credentials for discussing Scripture.

  • Primoveritas says:

    “Francois Demers:”

    Stay tuned because what the world is now BEGINNING to see transpiring, in ALL aspects of society (globally) was foretold, thousands of years in ADVANCE. It’s going to be an incomprehensible, bumpy ride at first, but it will subsequently culminate in humankind FINALLY achieving their most elusive, goal…PEACE among their fellow neighbors on this good earth!!!

    :-)

    • Francois Demers says:

      Primoveritas, if you mean Armageddon and then the millennium, thank you but I gave… and from my window (solidly anchored in the concrete of observable reality) only the Armageddon part works.

  • Primoveritas says:

    Ah, but you are being disingenuous when you assume, that, other than Biblical writings: “There is little to no evidence that events actually happened as written from other sources.” Roman historian/senator Tacitus, in his “Annals,” referred to Jesus and his crucifixion occurring at the bequest of Pontius Pilate. Tacitus’ writings are one of the earliest, non-Christian references to the origins of Christianity.

    Pagan historian Thallus likewise confirmed the truth of Jesus crucifixion and even mentions the supernatural darkness which permeated the land during Jesus’ three hours hanging on the “pole.” Several other PAGAN historians recorded the same particular blackout which occurred.

    Second century Greek writer, Lucian, documented Jesus as having introduced “new teachings” during his 3 1/2-year ministry, that Christians worshipped him, and that Jesus was crucified because he admonished the legalistic, hypocritical Jewish hierarchy. Other sources contend that Jesus was falsely accused of sedition against the Roman government, and was deemed a false “Messiah” because he did not overthrow the Roman government.

    Jewish historian, Josephus, who had a sterling reputation and was an ardent student of factual historicity, articulately wrote confirming Jesus’ life and death. There are many other NON-CHRISTIAN…NON-BIBLICAL sources, writers/historians who recorded the veracity of Jesus being a real person who had a ministry, fulfilled Old Testament prophecy of the coming Messiah and who was crucified in the exact way the scriptures foretold.

    As a very popular television series used to assert: “The truth is out there” but the vast majority of atheists/agnostics, would rather visit anti-God, anti-Jesus and anti-Bible, spurious Websites that spew venomous, vile and erroneous allegations and assumptions opined by others INSTEAD of researching the truth for themselves.

    You also fail to realize or are unable to distinguish that there is an Old Testament and a New Testament. One should “follow” those instructions that CURRENTLY remain active and pertain to whatever the subject matter reveals. The “good ole boy” network should be blamed for asserting that “women are lesser worth than men” but God reveals that that is not so. God does not advocate women being “raped or loaned out for sex.” Nowhere does God advocate polygamy but when MEN (NOT God) chose to go that route, God TOLERATED (NOT advocated) it but He WON’T in the future. The mixing of “fabrics” had to do specifically with the PRIEST’S garments (the statute did NOT apply to laymen). The concept was in regards to originality/purity, and was Old Testament law (it’s not mentioned in the New Testament nor is animal sacrifices). In like manner, O.T. animals were specifically chosen to sacrifice for sins/atonement and were not allowed to have any blemishes. Today, why would anyone choose to sacrifice animals for their sins when Jesus replaced that ritual by sacrificing his own life for all of us sinners on the cross? Those who have NOT read, researched, studied, pondered, WITHOUT bias, or tested the instructions revealed in the Bible (WITH AN OPEN MIND) are, actually, the ones who should be held accountable for their “pick and choose” ideologies.

    Regarding the other religions of the world and SOME of what their doctrines expound (those segments which are based upon God’s inimitable truths), research will confirm that they were borrowed from the Bible, NOT the other way around as you contend, and their founders were all Johnny-come-latelies.” Besides, none of their founders fulfilled, to the letter, what was foretold of Jesus, none were crucified and none were resurrected from the dead. They are all CLUELESS as to what God and Jesus’ magnificent plan entails for humankind. Did you know that there was a PAGAN king, mentioned in the O.T., who was aware of the Seventh Commandment, BEFORE Moses had even received the Ten Commandments on Mount Sinai?, which confirms that God’s laws/instructions have existed since humankind’s origin.

    Where do yo think any “idea” emanates from? What originates inside of our mind, comes to fruition, externally, but we all have “free will” to determine whether or not we should act upon the feeling.

    Peace,

    Primoveritas

  • Primoveritas says:

    I was referring (for starters) to an impending economic crash, a surge in extreme violence, an increase in natural disasters, a total falling away and famine of GOD’S Word, a false treaty promising global peace, a dictatorial leader of a one-world government, etc….PRIOR to your suggestion of “Armageddon,” followed by the return and intervention of Jesus Christ to save ALL life from being TOTALLY annihilated off of Planet Earth. Those events will be succeeded by a “millennium” to reconstruct the abject devastation marked by reeducation of the masses, and then concluding with one final earthly conflict which will quell evil forever.

    The generation which Old Testament prophecies identified, and certain specific events Jesus warned of that they would pertain to, became a reality in 1945, 1948 and 1967. The cynics and skeptics STOPPED laughing, regarding the prophecy revealed in Matthew 24: 21, 22 whenever the United States dropped two atomic bombs on the cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. The world now has biological, chemical and nuclear technology (stockpiled) that can wreak TOTAL annihilation upon earth’s inhabitants to the tune of many times OVERKILL. I refer you to the scorched earth mentality of Saddam who invaded Kuwait. When he realized he could not maintain his hold on the lucrative oil fields, he promptly set them on fire in hopes that no one else could have them, either. There are other Satanically inspired minds, somewhere out there, who harbor even more vile and evil aspirations. The gods of this world are $$$$ and power. Gone are the days of: “What can I, do for YOU?” which has since been replaced with: “What can YOU, do for ME?” And, so it goes.

    To reiterate…stay tuned.

    • Francois Demers says:

      Primoveritas, there is exactly zero contemporary documentary evidence for Jesus of Nazareth. This is called the “problem of the historical Jesus” by historians of all persuasions including Jesuits (and they do not come more devout than Jesuits).
      The only Scripture that is internally coherent and whose author is certainly known is the Quran.
      And as a devout Satanist, I would ask you to respect my religion as I respect yours.

      • primoveritas says:

        “Francois Demers:”

        On the contrary, there have been recent archaeological discoveries in Jerusalem, which further confirm the Bible’s veracity and also relate to things Jesus spoke of nearly 2000 years ago. Jesus’ prophecies which were marked for a FUTURE generation, are now rapidly coming to pass, including the technology that can annihilate all life from Planet Earth. That factor alone, is evidence you cannot refute nor disprove.

        The “Jesuits” you speak so highly of, had their day in the sun but now, unfortunately, their reflection has dulled and remains tarnished.

        The “Quran” contains over ninety verses that advocate murdering “infidels” which includes the beheading of ANY fellow human beings who do not agree with their ideologies. Their founder did NOT suffer and die for the sins of the world on a wooden cross so that humanity might be saved if they chose life.

        You are certainly NOT obligated “to respect” my beliefs nor I…yours. The scriptures reveal where Satan will subsequently end up, certainly a place I would not relish. Satan is fully aware, that his time (in governing this earth), is rapidly running out. Thus, we can expect more and more evil to escalate, just as Jesus predicted.

        • Francois Demers says:

          Primoveritas, invitation not to respect your religion acceptable to me as soon as you demonstrate having one instead of a set of blind beliefs, a curious fascination with your caps lock key, and, at best, obsolete information for which you do not quote sources.

          Should I not respond, do not conclude that I am persuaded, converted, or placated. That has never happened and my prophecy is that it shall continue not to happen.

          Blame my eventual silence to having been killed in a war.

          Should that happen, look for me at in the Afterlife as soon as possible and we can pick up from there.

          • Francois Demers says:

            Speaking of facing mortality…

          • primoveritas says:

            “Francois Demers:”

            I merely believe in the inspired principles set forth in the Bible. God and Jesus have instructed humankind how to live their lives in order to avoid pitfalls. The scriptures reveal what one must do in order to receive eternal life in accordance to THEIR infallible instruction book. It’s a disciplined, daily way of living which has NOTHING to do with “religion,” per se.

            My “beliefs” are NOT based upon “blind” faith as you assume. I isolate a particular Bible principle and then I act upon it. Over a period of time, I analyze the end results to confirm whether it bears out what it represents. It’s that simple. Most unbelievers “talk the talk” but do not “walk the walk” which is the difference between arriving at the truth or merely speculating and making unproven assumptions/allegations.

            I utilize the “caps lock key” merely for emphasis when I desire to make a word stand out in the sentence structure. It’s hardly a “curious fascination” as you seem to believe. If my “information” is “obsolete,” you would readily be able to refute or disprove it. I can provide secular, historical evidence as well as scriptural passages to verify whatever I quote. You HAVEN’T provided a single source in your missives to support your opinions. It’s the same tired old ploy I always hear from others who have NOT taken the time to implement the principles instructed in 2 Timothy 2:15. As a result, they end up fulfilling 2 Timothy 2:16.

            I DON’T write to persuade, convert or placate anyone, and I assure you that I will not lose ANY sleep over not hearing from you should you choose not to respond.

  • […] one who has been reading through the comments on my recent post about Jane Fonda – Facing Mortality – will have seen that there is a good and long-winded conversation going on about the Bible, […]

  • Francois Demers says:

    Primoveritas, it seems the prospect of war is fading. Thank you for providing comic relief. Nothing further.

    • primoveritas says:

      “Francois Demers,:

      I assume you are referring to what is currently happening in the Ukraine? Actually, it is I that should be thanking YOU “for providing comic relief” as it is apparent you haven’t read Matthew 24:6. This latest Russian conflict merely represents one in a series of ongoing, myriad, global rumblings as Matthew 24:7 confirms.

      You best keep your skeptical eyes squarely on the Middle East, especially Jerusalem, for a FUTURE, horrendous confrontation which is outlined in Zechariah 14:2, 3, 4, and the eventual fate/outcome (which isn’t very pretty) for those nations who have opposed Israel (Zechariah 14:12). Christ will subsequently rule over the entire earth (Zechariah 14:9).

      Your leader will NOT be pleased should you choose to read those scriptures for yourself, in order to arrive at the truth. Every given prophecy (yet pending) will be fulfilled, in spite of whether humanity chooses to believe it or not.

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